Technical Blog:

Do you still have the original seat belts (two-point, three-point, front, rear?) or do you have upgraded two-, three- or five-point belts? Did you add belts to the back seats?  Who manufactured your seat belts?  Thanks to Patrick Van Asbroeck for suggesting this question.

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From: Patrick Van Asbroeck;  Many thanks for using my belt request into the present QOTM.
Lap belts are not safe!! Some time ago I heard of a child being parellized in a collosion only wearing a lap belt. The force generated on the spine during the instantanious decceleration of the car had been too high. The upper part of the body has too much room to move around with a lap belt.
I still had the original lap belts at the front seats, chrome locks with porsche logo. I replaced them with shoulder belts.(three points)  The mounting points covered under black plastic washers located under the rear side windows make this a straightforward job.   Took the front belts from my wife's scrapped mazda 323 and used the nylon together with the original metal parts from the porsche lap belts and went to a local shoe repair shop. They have those heavy duty sewing machines for leather witch work just as well on nylon belts. Indicating the exact position where to stitch everything back together was all they further needed to know. The bolts needed to attach the belt under the rear window are fine thread ones. The ones from the mazda did fit.  At the rear there are no belts. This is one of the my next jobs to find out where and how they were fitted at the rear originally. Regards, Patrick

From: Wade Douglas; I cannot find evidence that my '65 912 ever had any seat belts (floor pan has no holes at all). I will fit belts when I finish restoration (I've owned it 15 years but never driven it!). I am curious what, if any, two or three point, appropriate-looking, new-manufacture belts are currently available and from whom. Wade Douglas - douglas@adnc.com

From: Fred Erickson;  In the name of safety(ok looks too), I up graded my seatbelts and seats to racing standards. I purchased a sweet Corbeau GT seat and bought two red Momo four-point racing harnesses to match. The extra side support is great for driving through all the canyons here in California and the looks I driving on the highway are always nice. Scott Erickson '66 912

From: William Dickson;  My 1969 came with, two point in the rear and three point in the front, don't know the brand. The front belts are old and a pain they are not retractable,would like to hear about some good replacments. William Dickson, The verry cherry 69, MRMAILBOX1@AOL
PS. I just had the Solex's rebuilt they work Great!!

From: James Scranton;  I still have the original 3 point seat belts, but I believe the owner before me replace the original buckles with vw buckles. I have no seat belts in the back. not to many people can ride back there anyway. Jim Scranton

From: Robert Burn; I still have the original two-point belts that came with the car when I bought it new. When the kids were little (maybe 1981 or so) I installed generic two-point seat belts in the back "seats" of the Targa. Thats all folks.

From: Scott McLean;  Still using the original seatbelts, three point, no problem. Seatbelts already installed in the rear - use them to hold two child safety seats for our twin 2 year olds. Scott McLean, 1969 912

From: Gary Bayless;  I have upgraded to 5 point belts. Most hillclimb organizations require at least 4 point belts, besides you have more control of the car not moving all over the place.  Used the existing front and rear mounting points. The back seat mounting
points are used on the shoulder harness, then we only had to drill one hole under the seat for the 5th belt.  1969 912  Gary Bayless

From: Randy Cohen;  69 targa stock belts, but have sport seats from a 78 and the automotion adapters. The problem is where do you mount the belts? Newer seats don't have mount hole and I don't want to weld into the body. Anyone put the mount tabs on the adapters?

From: Gordon Ross;  I still have the original belts, though they have been ungainly, have no retractors, and were always hanging out the door, hard to find and reloop over my body, etc.. SO, I put Velcro on the plastic snap covers (or whatever they're called) and added the matching Velcro pieces at shoulder height just ahead of the bottom leading edge of the rear side windows. Now I can easily hang up the belts each time I unsnap them. Now they're much easier to live with and I've kept the originality with a very low cost fix (99 cents for materials....the lowest cost repair or improvement on the entire car). I bought my 1969 912 used, with matching belts for the rear seats...snaps with little arms, covered with small, bright red plastic levers. My current problem is how to replace the other straps back there....the ones that apparently hold the seat backs upright. I assume these were leather and there was some form of anchoring spot on the backs of the seat. Am I correct? Gordon Ross, '69 912 coupe

From: Andy Hunn;  Still have original lap belts in front.  No belts in back seats.

From: William Todd;  When I built the 912, there were miserable old VW belts installed in it, and only lap belts. Beefing up the suspension brakes and engine called for better seat belts and harnesses. It's nice to go fast, and stop on a dime, but-----not through the windshield!
I used aircraft seat belts with red nylon strapping and a single release lever, ala military lap belts/ harnesses. I also added shoulder harnesses. I single pointed the shoulder harnesses, using a large ring eye bolt available from Automotion in Sunnyvale, CA. It is their p/n SE-60001. I used large area "fender washers" on both sides of the eyebolt to prevent it pulling through the floor pan under stress when I bolted it all together.
The belts and harnesses are available from: Columbia Aviation in Troutdale, Oregon. They used to come in several colors, and are a slick item for a reasonably low price. Talk to Dave Sturges at Columbia for assistance, and tell him I sent 'ya--they are old friends. They also have a huge supply of "AN" hardware and hosing I used in my engine oil modifications. The seat belts were re-manufactured at the time, and the hardware was re-plated. I don't know who the manufacturer was, but it was done to aircraft specifications, which are really tough, and a lot higher requirements that automotive standards.
I have installed red leather hi-backs with seat rail adapters after a fender bender tosed me around a bit. Glad I did. I was rear ended lightly, and the high back cushioned my head, which I would not have had
in the low-backs I replaced.
I also have sheepskins on the seats, and had them add a strap high up on both sides of each seat. I run the shoulder harnesses through the tabs, and they are available for quick attachment. The harnesses have a long slotted tab that engages the locking mechanism on the lap belt. One flip of the spring loaded and locked lever gets me out in a split second --which is really cool if you're damaged and on fire!
I don't like the later stock, three point lap belts. In a case of side impact the damn shoulder strap tends to slice your neck off. The shoulder harnesses I use are doubled, and it is really a secure feeling
being belted in in that little white car of mine, one large 2" lap belt and the 2" shoulder harnesses over each shoulder. Ciao, Bill

From: Steve and Denise;  Hi Rick, The belts in my 1969 912 are the stock 3pt in front and the stock 2 pt rear belts. I'm unsure if the rear are stock. Thanks Steve Lynch

From: Johnflacey;  On my 69 Targa #593 I have all original OEM 3 points without retractors in the front and two points in the jump seats in the back. They work fine except for the repeated tendency for the plastic covers on the fixed points on the floor to pop off. The strap retainers on the driver's side were once reglued, as they had apparently cracked apart. I use WD40 on the mechanisms once or twice a year. It appears mine were manufactured in Germany by Repa, specifically for Porsche whose name appears on the tags in the traditional script. They even say "Made in 1968" on the label, consistent with the fact that all 68 and 69 Targas were made in 68 as the factory retooled in mid-year for the introduction of the 914. Very best regards, John L.

From: Carter Willey; Great topic; thanks, Rick.
My 1968 originally had lap belts installed for the front seats only. They were in poor condition, and I really wanted three-point belts.
I use my car in my business, shuttling customers around town. I also use the rear seats often; my daughter and her teen-aged friends fold themselves up and ride back there.
I had some Kangol magnetic-latch belts from an old Mercedes, and I installed these in the 912. I find the simple cam-and-magnet latch of the belts truly elegant and in harmony with the Porsche esthetic.
The belts have metal tabs with holes at the anchorage end, so I used 7/16 UNF grade-8 bolts (standard for seat belt anchorages) to secure them. The angles of the tabs were not always ideal, but this was not a big problem. The mounting points for the belts are too high, causing the belt to ride too far up on the torso. I believe the points were changed for 1969.
I have only lap belts for the rear seats; I'd like to have shoulder belts as the rear seats are often used. The lap belts from the Mercedes were much longer than necessary for the Porsche, and again the angles of the tabs on the belts are all wrong, but passengers are able to be adequately buckled in.
Since I often chauffeur people unfamilar with older cars, I have a speech prepared on how the seat belts work. People are really used to modern belts and are not prepared for a belt which is not on a reel. And of course I get to tell my riders how to open the door at the end of the trip.
Now if only I could get them not to slam the door.
Carter Willey, 1968 912

From: V.J. Lovero;  I have purchased extremely nice, 3-point, retractable belts with chrome buckles from P-E-Parts. The system is very efficient and was installed easily by my mechanic at the existing mounting points. The belts came with all necessary hardware and clear instructions. Also, for 20 dollars extra, I got nice Porsche badges on the buckles. The only downside to this package, is that the rear seats rub on the retracting unit when putting them up or down.
For the back, I bought lap belts only. These required much more extensive work to install. Some cutting was required and my mechanic took it upon himself to do some welding at the mounting points. This was a lot of work and was quite expensive, but I have a couple of school-age boys who like to
ride in the back of Dad's 912. I highly recommend these products.
P-E-Parts website can be found at: http://www.peparts.com
V.J. Lovero, 1966 sunroof coupe

From: Alexander Wachter;  My 68 912 Coupe still has three point seat belts with very nice closure in chrome with a small coloured Porsche logo on it. Would be nice to have a picture on that on the web! On the tiny back seats are two point belts with same closure. I found out that these chrome closure are hard to get items on the market here in Germany. Regards, Alex

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